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The statistics like the White Sox

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  • The statistics like the White Sox

    White Sox #1 in the MLB power rankings
    https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-power-r...s-after-week-6

    White Sox #1 in the Fangraphs power rankings (the Red Sox are the only team Fangraphs ranks in the same tier):
    https://blogs.fangraphs.com/fangraph...ngs-may-10-16/

    White Sox lead all of baseball in run differential
    https://www.teamrankings.com/mlb/stat/run-differential

    White Sox are #3 in Team WAR (behind Toronto and the Padres)
    https://www.baseball-reference.com/l...am_compare.cgi

    Fangraphs gives the Sox a 74.3% chance to win the division, a 79.6% chance to make the playoffs, and a 7.5% chance to win the World Series. That World Series chance number is not good, as it is significantly lower than any other division leader except the Brewers. Even the lowly Mets have a higher WS chance.
    https://www.fangraphs.com/standings/playoff-odds

    It will be an interesting matchup against the Yankees for sure, a team that on paper is the class of the AL but in practice has been struggling a bit. On paper the Yankees should clobber the Sox but a lot of the advanced metrics like the Sox better, and a lot better. Also non-advanced metrics like W-L record.
    "Hope...may be indulged in by those who have abundant resources...but those who stake their all upon the venture see it in its true colors only after they are ruined."
    -- Thucydides

  • #2
    Amusingly, the White Sox are tied for first place in WAR by pinch hitters, with a WAR of 0.1 from the PH "position". I wonder how much of that is from that one single Yermin Mercedes at-bat against the Twins lol.
    "Hope...may be indulged in by those who have abundant resources...but those who stake their all upon the venture see it in its true colors only after they are ruined."
    -- Thucydides

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    • #3
      Originally posted by HomeFish View Post
      Amusingly, the White Sox are tied for first place in WAR by pinch hitters, with a WAR of 0.1 from the PH "position". I wonder how much of that is from that one single Yermin Mercedes at-bat against the Twins lol.
      Eaton hit a pinch-hit home run in the April 11 loss to the Royals. There was a man on base, and it gave the Sox a 3-2 lead going into the ninth. For the Royals, Santana opened the ninth with a home run to tie the game. Of course, the Royals pushed across the placed-on-second runner in the tenth without hitting the ball out of the infield before Eaton opened the Sox half of the tenth with Eaton and Collins strikeouts and closed out the game with a Madrigal ground out. Strangely enough, it was a game started by Cease. Sort of puts the decision to have Eaton bunt into perspective.

      The way the Sox have been playing in May, it's easy to forget about April.

      Anyway, the Eaton home run and the Mercedes pinch-hit against the Twins last week are the only pinch hits the Sox have had in ten pinch-hitting appearances this season. Two hits, two strikeouts, one walk (Mendick), no grounding into double plays for a .222 batting average, .300 on-base percentage and .556 slugging percentage, along with very meaningful late RBIs.

      I haven't looked at other American League teams, but you would expect National League teams to have more pinch-hitting. The Dodgers, for example, have used 12 pinch-hitters compared to the five used by the White Sox, for 63 appearances. They have three pinch-hit home runs and a .196 pinch-hit average and nine RBIs. But Clayton Kershaw has more pinch-hitting appearances (two, both strikeouts) than Jake Lamb (one, a weak groundout for Madrigal in a 4-2 loss to Cleveland). Lamb would be getting a lot of pinch-hits elsewhere as a left-handed bat off the bench.

      There has always been two elements to managers pinch-hitting. There is the strategic, but thee is also the desperation. The DH has limited the desperation -- i.e., hitting for the pitcher More relievers and less position flexibility on the bench (particularly on the White Sox where some have complained that it is a lack of depth) have limited the strategic.

      Of the pinch-hitting measures of success, WAR falls on the meaningless end of the spectrum.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by TDog View Post
        Eaton hit a pinch-hit home run in the April 11 loss to the Royals. There was a man on base, and it gave the Sox a 3-2 lead going into the ninth. For the Royals, Santana opened the ninth with a home run to tie the game. Of course, the Royals pushed across the placed-on-second runner in the tenth without hitting the ball out of the infield before Eaton opened the Sox half of the tenth with Eaton and Collins strikeouts and closed out the game with a Madrigal ground out. Strangely enough, it was a game started by Cease. Sort of puts the decision to have Eaton bunt into perspective.

        The way the Sox have been playing in May, it's easy to forget about April.
        I actually do remember this, and it's because I was driving by the stadium at the time it happened. I was merging from the Skyway into the Dan Ryan when Eaton hit that home run, heading north. All I could think was that if I had spent less time at the gas station earlier, I could have been driving by the park right as the fireworks went off. Sadly, Madrigal was batting at the time I actually drove by the park so there was zero chance of that.
        "Hope...may be indulged in by those who have abundant resources...but those who stake their all upon the venture see it in its true colors only after they are ruined."
        -- Thucydides

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        • #5
          Originally posted by TDog View Post
          But Clayton Kershaw has more pinch-hitting appearances (two, both strikeouts) than Jake Lamb (one, a weak groundout for Madrigal in a 4-2 loss to Cleveland). Lamb would be getting a lot of pinch-hits elsewhere as a left-handed bat off the bench.
          It's a bit of a problem that Lamb hasn't been good enough that he is in consideration to use as a pinch hitter more often.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ChiTownTrojan View Post

            It's a bit of a problem that Lamb hasn't been good enough that he is in consideration to use as a pinch hitter more often.
            I don't think that's the issue. For example, Lamb obviously would have been the go-to pinch hitter in the 1-0 loss in Cincinnati, but there was the double-switch instead, and, as it turned out, his spot didn't come up in the batting order. The lack of pinch-hitting has more to do with not having a pitcher in the lineup and where the pinch-hitting would leave the White Sox defensively. Lamb might be hitting better if he were getting more playing time, more at bats. But he isn't going to get a lot of DH appearances, and he isn't going to get a lot of starts at third or first.

            Comment


            • #7
              Another amazing stat about this year's White Sox:

              After 39 games this year, they are 24-15.

              In 2020, after 39 games, they were 24-15.

              What a difference a year makes!

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by TDog View Post

                I don't think that's the issue. For example, Lamb obviously would have been the go-to pinch hitter in the 1-0 loss in Cincinnati, but there was the double-switch instead, and, as it turned out, his spot didn't come up in the batting order. The lack of pinch-hitting has more to do with not having a pitcher in the lineup and where the pinch-hitting would leave the White Sox defensively. Lamb might be hitting better if he were getting more playing time, more at bats. But he isn't going to get a lot of DH appearances, and he isn't going to get a lot of starts at third or first.
                Pinch hitting doesn't only need to be for a pitcher, especially when you have multiple guys in the starting lineup who are hitting below .200 with bad splits against the handedness of the pitcher. In the game against Cincinnati that you brought up, both Garcia and Hamilton batted in the 10th against the Reds' RHP. Both (quite predictably) made outs. It would have been nice to have a good LH bench bat, but sadly Lamb doesn't qualify (and neither does Collins apparently to La Russa).

                The main point is, what is Lamb's value to the roster? As you correctly pointed out, he's not going to get many starts at any position (3B/1B/DH/even LF), and he is something like the 4th best defensive option on the roster at all those positions (other than DH). If he isn't going to get many starts, and he isn't a defensive replacement, and he isn't going to pinch hit, then what exactly is he doing here?

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'm assuming when Adam returns Lamb is gone. I think Hamilton has helped the team and needs to stay of the big league roster.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Lipman 1 View Post
                    I'm assuming when Adam returns Lamb is gone. I think Hamilton has helped the team and needs to stay of the big league roster.
                    I agree and I wouldn't be surprised to see them then bring up Sheets to replace Mendick so they have another bat on the bench. However it might be Sheets for Hamilton. I think they need some more potential PH and Sheets is on fire at Charlotte.

                    Edit if they go Sheets for Hamilton then they'd have a ton of roster flexibility, though they'd lose some speed off the bench
                    Riding Shotgun on the Sox Bandwagon since before there was an Internet...



                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Lipman 1 View Post
                      I'm assuming when Adam returns Lamb is gone. I think Hamilton has helped the team and needs to stay of the big league roster.
                      I assume you're referring to Adam E., right?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by voodoochile View Post

                        I agree and I wouldn't be surprised to see them then bring up Sheets to replace Mendick so they have another bat on the bench. However it might be Sheets for Hamilton. I think they need some more potential PH and Sheets is on fire at Charlotte.

                        Edit if they go Sheets for Hamilton then they'd have a ton of roster flexibility, though they'd lose some speed off the bench
                        If Mendick and Lamb are both gone, then Leury becomes the only backup for 2B, SS, and 3B. I don't think Hamilton's defense is as necessary with Engel the likely everyday CF, so I think Mendick would stay.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by ChiTownTrojan View Post

                          Pinch hitting doesn't only need to be for a pitcher, especially when you have multiple guys in the starting lineup who are hitting below .200 with bad splits against the handedness of the pitcher. In the game against Cincinnati that you brought up, both Garcia and Hamilton batted in the 10th against the Reds' RHP. Both (quite predictably) made outs. It would have been nice to have a good LH bench bat, but sadly Lamb doesn't qualify (and neither does Collins apparently to La Russa).

                          The main point is, what is Lamb's value to the roster? As you correctly pointed out, he's not going to get many starts at any position (3B/1B/DH/even LF), and he is something like the 4th best defensive option on the roster at all those positions (other than DH). If he isn't going to get many starts, and he isn't a defensive replacement, and he isn't going to pinch hit, then what exactly is he doing here?
                          Of course, the White Sox won six straight after losing that game and have since overtaken and pulled two games ahead of Cleveland, but fans will continue to complain about it. At the time, there wasn't enough outfield depth to pinch hit for Garcia or Hamilton because you have to play defense in the bottom of the inning, especially considering the White Sox have been unable to do anything this year in extas with the runner starting at second. Coming into the Reds game, Sox hitters were 0-for-6 with three strikeouts in two 10th innings where opposing teams scored what proved to be the winning runs without hitting the ball out of the infield. Garcia and Hamilton are quite capable of not hitting the ball out of the infield. The Sox are 0-3 in extra-inning games because they are not built to either defend nor offensively execute small ball. Garcial and Hamilton didn't execute, but they had a better chance of executing small ball than Collins, especially if you consider the defensive consequences of pinch-hitting with Collins. The chance of needing a fourth catcher in the bottom of the tenth is slim anyway,

                          One of the reasons Sunday's win was so satisfying was that it was so much like winning an extra-inning game after the opposing team scored in the top of the inning, although Anderson. had to earn his way to second to start the inning. The sacrifice bunt to draw-in the infield, the hit through the drawn in infield and everything that came after that worked in large part because the Sox had the right part of the order up, but in that April 11 4-3 loss to the Royals, with Nick Williams at second and Eaton up down a run in the tenth, Eaton struck out and Collins struck out and Williams was still at second when Madrigal grounded out.

                          If you look at other American League teams who aren't in desperation mode (i.e.the Twins, Angels and Tigers), you generally see a position for position swap for DH, which would be like Collins batting for Grandal or Mendick batting for Madrigal. Cleveland has 20 pinch-hit appearances, eight by Bauers, but it looks like Bauers hit once for a relief pitcher and seven times for first baseman that he replaced in the field. in sort of a platoon situation. If you want pitchers to make up half of your roster, you're not going to pinch-hitters for players like Garcia and Hamilton, who, but for the injuries, in the best of times would be the players on the bench and available to pinch-hit when the team is losing late in the game.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by voodoochile View Post

                            I agree and I wouldn't be surprised to see them then bring up Sheets to replace Mendick so they have another bat on the bench. However it might be Sheets for Hamilton. I think they need some more potential PH and Sheets is on fire at Charlotte.

                            Edit if they go Sheets for Hamilton then they'd have a ton of roster flexibility, though they'd lose some speed off the bench
                            Mendick makes Leury superfluous. Leury is the guy who should go. Mendick does all the same things, and his bat isn’t made of wet spaghetti.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Mohoney View Post

                              Mendick makes Leury superfluous. Leury is the guy who should go. Mendick does all the same things, and his bat isn’t made of wet spaghetti.
                              You might be right, but I don't know if Mendick works in center. If you're activating Engel, Garcia might well be expendable. Without Robert, sadly, and without Garcia, you're just left with Hamilton in center, unless you want to try Anderson out there. There aren't enough roster spots to carry simply a hitter, other than Mercedes. Having pinch-hitters on the bench is irrelevant if they would have to be replaced defensively.

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